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	<title>Comments on: Nightmares of the Scuba Police</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/2009/11/18/diving-wit-the-scuba-police/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/2009/11/18/diving-wit-the-scuba-police/</link>
	<description>Diving opinions from top diving experts in the dive industry</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 23:27:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Robert Levine</title>
		<link>http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/2009/11/18/diving-wit-the-scuba-police/comment-page-1/#comment-4762</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Levine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Dec 2011 23:51:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/?p=373#comment-4762</guid>
		<description>THANK YOU AGAIN AND AGAIN I LIVE AND DIVE NEW JERSEY EVEN IN THE WINTER MONTHS.I DIVE SOLO EVEN ON WRECK DIVES.INLET AND JETTY  DIVES SPEAR FISHING.WE HAVE A SAYING WERE JUST DIVING ON THE SAME DAY IN THE SAME OCEAN I HAVE OFFTEN SAID EVEN IF YOUR BUDDY IS ON THE SAME WRECK AS YOU MOST LIKELY HE OR SHE CANNOT SEE YOU OR EVEN KNOW YOUR HAVING A PROBLEM SO ANY THING THAT HAPPEN YOU HAVE TO BE COOL HEADED AND FIGURE IT OUT YOUR SELF  AND BE SELF SEFICENT. OR YOU SHOULD NOT BE DIVING.  MOST OF ALL KNOW YOUR LIMITS.IF YOU NEVER WRECKED DIVE OVER HEAD ENVIRORMENTS TAKE A CLASS SEE IF IT FOR YOU GET A MENTOR JOIN A GROUP PICK A LOT OF BRAINS. I ALWAYS SAY IF YOU DO NOT FEEL RIGHT YOUR GEAR IS NOT RIGHT SOME THING BOTHING YOU MENTALLY OR PHYICAL DO NOT DIVE  ONE ONE WILL PUT YOU DOWN OR SAY ANYTHING SIT THE DIVE OUT   YOU CAN ALLWAY  DIVE TOMMOROW OR NEXT WEEK   BUT I DO TRAVEL AND DIVE THE WORLD. WITH OUT MY WIFE FIRST THING I DO I CHECK UNDERCURRENTS MY BIBLE.I HATE WHEN I AM TOLD EVERY DIVER WAITS TILL THE DM IS IN THE WATER TILL WE GO DOWN  OR YOU MUST STAY WITH YOUR BUDDY  IF HE GOES UP YOU GO UP..I FIND THIS  MOSTLY ON LAND BASED OPERATIONS  NOT SO MUCH ON LIVERABOARDS. COCOS UNDERSEA HUNTER 2X . TRUK ODDYESS. ECT TOP RATED  IN MY BOOK FOR DOING YOUR OUN PROFILE  DIVING .I ONCE WENT ON A CRUISE SHIP WITH MY WIFE SHE DOES NOT DIVE WE TAKE SEPRARATE VACACTION TOGETHER.LOL.ONCE IN A WHILE.WE TOOK A CRUISE SHIP IT STOPED IN ARUBA I BOOKED A DIVE ON THE UTILA WRECK THEY BUDDY ME UP WITH A   DIVE WHO HAD A PROBLEM WITH HIS EARS. AFTER 15 OR 20 FEET HE TOLD ME HE WAS GOING UP I CONTINUED MY DIVE ONLY TO HAVE SOME DM COME UP TO MY FACE SHOWING OR TELLING ME WHERE IS MY BUDDY I LOOKED AND HIM AND POINTED UP AND CONTINUDED MY DIVE WHEN I GOT BACK ON THE BOAT HE CHEWED ME OUT I  KINDLY  TOLD HIM I WAS IN ARUBA ONLY ONE DAY AND I PAYED TO MAKE A DIVE NOT BABY SIT ON THE DIVE BOAT AND THAT WAS HIS JOB NOT MINE.BADGES I DIDNOT SEE NO STINKIN BADGES.I ALSO MADE HIM WAIT A GOOD 30 MINUTES  EXTRA BEFORE I SURFACED KNOWING EVERY ONE ELSE WAS ALLREADY ON BOARD THE BOAT TOLD HIM MY COMPUTER MADE ME DO MY HANG AND I DID NOT WANT TO GET BENT ON THE CRUISE SHIP I WAS ON VACATION.AND STILL HAD 100PSI AIR IN MY TANK..AND I WAS FROM NEW JERSEY DID HE HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>THANK YOU AGAIN AND AGAIN I LIVE AND DIVE NEW JERSEY EVEN IN THE WINTER MONTHS.I DIVE SOLO EVEN ON WRECK DIVES.INLET AND JETTY  DIVES SPEAR FISHING.WE HAVE A SAYING WERE JUST DIVING ON THE SAME DAY IN THE SAME OCEAN I HAVE OFFTEN SAID EVEN IF YOUR BUDDY IS ON THE SAME WRECK AS YOU MOST LIKELY HE OR SHE CANNOT SEE YOU OR EVEN KNOW YOUR HAVING A PROBLEM SO ANY THING THAT HAPPEN YOU HAVE TO BE COOL HEADED AND FIGURE IT OUT YOUR SELF  AND BE SELF SEFICENT. OR YOU SHOULD NOT BE DIVING.  MOST OF ALL KNOW YOUR LIMITS.IF YOU NEVER WRECKED DIVE OVER HEAD ENVIRORMENTS TAKE A CLASS SEE IF IT FOR YOU GET A MENTOR JOIN A GROUP PICK A LOT OF BRAINS. I ALWAYS SAY IF YOU DO NOT FEEL RIGHT YOUR GEAR IS NOT RIGHT SOME THING BOTHING YOU MENTALLY OR PHYICAL DO NOT DIVE  ONE ONE WILL PUT YOU DOWN OR SAY ANYTHING SIT THE DIVE OUT   YOU CAN ALLWAY  DIVE TOMMOROW OR NEXT WEEK   BUT I DO TRAVEL AND DIVE THE WORLD. WITH OUT MY WIFE FIRST THING I DO I CHECK UNDERCURRENTS MY BIBLE.I HATE WHEN I AM TOLD EVERY DIVER WAITS TILL THE DM IS IN THE WATER TILL WE GO DOWN  OR YOU MUST STAY WITH YOUR BUDDY  IF HE GOES UP YOU GO UP..I FIND THIS  MOSTLY ON LAND BASED OPERATIONS  NOT SO MUCH ON LIVERABOARDS. COCOS UNDERSEA HUNTER 2X . TRUK ODDYESS. ECT TOP RATED  IN MY BOOK FOR DOING YOUR OUN PROFILE  DIVING .I ONCE WENT ON A CRUISE SHIP WITH MY WIFE SHE DOES NOT DIVE WE TAKE SEPRARATE VACACTION TOGETHER.LOL.ONCE IN A WHILE.WE TOOK A CRUISE SHIP IT STOPED IN ARUBA I BOOKED A DIVE ON THE UTILA WRECK THEY BUDDY ME UP WITH A   DIVE WHO HAD A PROBLEM WITH HIS EARS. AFTER 15 OR 20 FEET HE TOLD ME HE WAS GOING UP I CONTINUED MY DIVE ONLY TO HAVE SOME DM COME UP TO MY FACE SHOWING OR TELLING ME WHERE IS MY BUDDY I LOOKED AND HIM AND POINTED UP AND CONTINUDED MY DIVE WHEN I GOT BACK ON THE BOAT HE CHEWED ME OUT I  KINDLY  TOLD HIM I WAS IN ARUBA ONLY ONE DAY AND I PAYED TO MAKE A DIVE NOT BABY SIT ON THE DIVE BOAT AND THAT WAS HIS JOB NOT MINE.BADGES I DIDNOT SEE NO STINKIN BADGES.I ALSO MADE HIM WAIT A GOOD 30 MINUTES  EXTRA BEFORE I SURFACED KNOWING EVERY ONE ELSE WAS ALLREADY ON BOARD THE BOAT TOLD HIM MY COMPUTER MADE ME DO MY HANG AND I DID NOT WANT TO GET BENT ON THE CRUISE SHIP I WAS ON VACATION.AND STILL HAD 100PSI AIR IN MY TANK..AND I WAS FROM NEW JERSEY DID HE HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT?
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/2009/11/18/diving-wit-the-scuba-police/comment-page-1/#comment-4100</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2011 04:46:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/?p=373#comment-4100</guid>
		<description>Bret,

Well stated, we fully agree, and I am sure to catch some heat for saying this but situation has been exaborated by the dive industry trends in getting more divers in the sport "ready or not" caused by resort certifications for vacationers on hand held dives. The "PADI" modular approach,"Put Another Dollar In" and HOPE to see you again Certifications, has put a strain on Freedoms regardless of individual skills/experience. I was 1st certified PADI in early 70's and later NAUI Advanced while vacationing 80's, training was very similar then unlike today, really scary from a liabilty point of view. I do alot of solo diving these days minimizes restrictions, freedoms, as well as the pains you mention here. Plus I always know where my dive buddy is without using extra tanks of air searching. 

These Quicky Certifications from resorts started this trend and now parinoid of it's consequences, restrict everyones freedoms in the name of safety or $.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bret,</p>
<p>Well stated, we fully agree, and I am sure to catch some heat for saying this but situation has been exaborated by the dive industry trends in getting more divers in the sport &#8220;ready or not&#8221; caused by resort certifications for vacationers on hand held dives. The &#8220;PADI&#8221; modular approach,&#8221;Put Another Dollar In&#8221; and HOPE to see you again Certifications, has put a strain on Freedoms regardless of individual skills/experience. I was 1st certified PADI in early 70&#8217;s and later NAUI Advanced while vacationing 80&#8217;s, training was very similar then unlike today, really scary from a liabilty point of view. I do alot of solo diving these days minimizes restrictions, freedoms, as well as the pains you mention here. Plus I always know where my dive buddy is without using extra tanks of air searching. </p>
<p>These Quicky Certifications from resorts started this trend and now parinoid of it&#8217;s consequences, restrict everyones freedoms in the name of safety or $.
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		<title>By: bret gilliam</title>
		<link>http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/2009/11/18/diving-wit-the-scuba-police/comment-page-1/#comment-4078</link>
		<dc:creator>bret gilliam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Aug 2011 15:11:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/?p=373#comment-4078</guid>
		<description>Allan,

Basically, your perspective is pretty "right on".There are a variety of liability issues and breaches of duty when a "supervisor" or a professional has a responsibility to perform as the "reasonably prudent instructor or divemaster" should... and then makes the wrong decision that endangers or kills a student or customer. It's complicated. I live in this "real world" since I do so much litigation work as an expert witness, for both plaintiffs and defense. In spite of my best efforts to advise the current diving industry on standards of practice, we still see some incredible mistakes and simple departures from common sense. My advice is keep yourself educated on your computer, your dive profile and deco status, and never fail to use your own best judgment if confronted with some idiot who wants you to do something stupid. The current corps of instructors and divemasters that have been turned out in the last decade is, to be diplomatic, less than what I would hope for. The problem is that the overall curricula for divers and instructors has been "dumbed down". Don't fall victim to some dimwit if you are more experienced. It's your life and health. Choose wisely and err on the side of caution.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Allan,</p>
<p>Basically, your perspective is pretty &#8220;right on&#8221;.There are a variety of liability issues and breaches of duty when a &#8220;supervisor&#8221; or a professional has a responsibility to perform as the &#8220;reasonably prudent instructor or divemaster&#8221; should&#8230; and then makes the wrong decision that endangers or kills a student or customer. It&#8217;s complicated. I live in this &#8220;real world&#8221; since I do so much litigation work as an expert witness, for both plaintiffs and defense. In spite of my best efforts to advise the current diving industry on standards of practice, we still see some incredible mistakes and simple departures from common sense. My advice is keep yourself educated on your computer, your dive profile and deco status, and never fail to use your own best judgment if confronted with some idiot who wants you to do something stupid. The current corps of instructors and divemasters that have been turned out in the last decade is, to be diplomatic, less than what I would hope for. The problem is that the overall curricula for divers and instructors has been &#8220;dumbed down&#8221;. Don&#8217;t fall victim to some dimwit if you are more experienced. It&#8217;s your life and health. Choose wisely and err on the side of caution.
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		<title>By: Allen A. Smith</title>
		<link>http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/2009/11/18/diving-wit-the-scuba-police/comment-page-1/#comment-4077</link>
		<dc:creator>Allen A. Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Aug 2011 14:15:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/?p=373#comment-4077</guid>
		<description>As a prospective juror, I would say that forcibly surfacing a diver or denying a diver the use of his computer would void the liability waiver.  Forcibly ending a safety stop might even constitute "reckless endangerment," which is a crime.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a prospective juror, I would say that forcibly surfacing a diver or denying a diver the use of his computer would void the liability waiver.  Forcibly ending a safety stop might even constitute &#8220;reckless endangerment,&#8221; which is a crime.
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		<title>By: Bret Gilliam</title>
		<link>http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/2009/11/18/diving-wit-the-scuba-police/comment-page-1/#comment-3953</link>
		<dc:creator>Bret Gilliam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Jun 2011 21:34:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.undercurrent.org/blog/?p=373#comment-3953</guid>
		<description>Stephen,

There is a growing movement within the experienced diver community to "share" information about resorts and liveaboards to enlighten each other about the ones that have stupid rules and bad attitudes for competent independent divers. It's sort of an unofficial fraternity that constantly updates each other about what to seek out... and what to avoid. Some of the worst for idiotic "rules" have traditionally been in the Caymans and parts of the Bahamas. But a lot of these places finally began to wise up  when their business became almost exclusively based on a the beginner and inexperienced types who needed constant attention. Sadly, by then the diving had deteriorated to the point that the places were not worth visiting anyway. 

Even professionals like me have encountered divemasters or operators who simply could not be dealt with. My choice was to simply ignore them, do my own dives, and get away from their operation as quickly as possible. This was even more inane when I was doing feature articles for big magazines and they had to know that such treatment would result in bad reviews... no matter what they spent on ads. (Skindiver magazine was, of course, the exception. By the mid-1980s until their demise in 2002, they'd give anyone a rave review if you bought enough ad space. "Dive Fantastic World Class Nebraska!)

Undercurrent still remains the best single source for unbiased objective information. Read their online issues and the annual Chapbook for good info, about both bad and good.

When I sold the last of my big diving companies, I resorted to organizing my own trips and chartering entire vessels filled with hand-picked customers. And I made it clear what we expected from the operator: no hassles, good support, pleasant staff, no stupid rules, etc. I've still been doing it now for six years since I sold Fathoms magazine and keep a close-knit group of great divers heading off to Indonesia, the Solomon Islands, and other exotic locations.

I can recommend strongly the superb services of Dive Damai in Indonesia and the Bilikiki in the Solomons. Peter Hughes' new operation called DivEncounters is excellent as is the Sea Hunter fleet in Cocos. One of the best in the world is the Odyssey in Truk Lagoon (Chuuk). Also, Sam's Tours in Palau gets consistent high grades. Bill Acker's Manta Ray Resort in Yap is excellent as well.

But remember: it works both ways. Operations have a duty and a right to interdict and restrict unsafe or unqualified divers from getting themselves into trouble. I always vetted my customers personally and made certain that they were excellent divers... but also socially acceptable. There's nothing worse than getting stuck for a couple of weeks with some moron that you can't even stand to sit next to for lunch.

But I counsel doing serious research in advance before laying out your hard earned money. If I can ever be of help, I'll give it to you straight. Contact me: bretgilliam@gmail.com

Good luck!

Bret</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stephen,</p>
<p>There is a growing movement within the experienced diver community to &#8220;share&#8221; information about resorts and liveaboards to enlighten each other about the ones that have stupid rules and bad attitudes for competent independent divers. It&#8217;s sort of an unofficial fraternity that constantly updates each other about what to seek out&#8230; and what to avoid. Some of the worst for idiotic &#8220;rules&#8221; have traditionally been in the Caymans and parts of the Bahamas. But a lot of these places finally began to wise up  when their business became almost exclusively based on a the beginner and inexperienced types who needed constant attention. Sadly, by then the diving had deteriorated to the point that the places were not worth visiting anyway. </p>
<p>Even professionals like me have encountered divemasters or operators who simply could not be dealt with. My choice was to simply ignore them, do my own dives, and get away from their operation as quickly as possible. This was even more inane when I was doing feature articles for big magazines and they had to know that such treatment would result in bad reviews&#8230; no matter what they spent on ads. (Skindiver magazine was, of course, the exception. By the mid-1980s until their demise in 2002, they&#8217;d give anyone a rave review if you bought enough ad space. &#8220;Dive Fantastic World Class Nebraska!)</p>
<p>Undercurrent still remains the best single source for unbiased objective information. Read their online issues and the annual Chapbook for good info, about both bad and good.</p>
<p>When I sold the last of my big diving companies, I resorted to organizing my own trips and chartering entire vessels filled with hand-picked customers. And I made it clear what we expected from the operator: no hassles, good support, pleasant staff, no stupid rules, etc. I&#8217;ve still been doing it now for six years since I sold Fathoms magazine and keep a close-knit group of great divers heading off to Indonesia, the Solomon Islands, and other exotic locations.</p>
<p>I can recommend strongly the superb services of Dive Damai in Indonesia and the Bilikiki in the Solomons. Peter Hughes&#8217; new operation called DivEncounters is excellent as is the Sea Hunter fleet in Cocos. One of the best in the world is the Odyssey in Truk Lagoon (Chuuk). Also, Sam&#8217;s Tours in Palau gets consistent high grades. Bill Acker&#8217;s Manta Ray Resort in Yap is excellent as well.</p>
<p>But remember: it works both ways. Operations have a duty and a right to interdict and restrict unsafe or unqualified divers from getting themselves into trouble. I always vetted my customers personally and made certain that they were excellent divers&#8230; but also socially acceptable. There&#8217;s nothing worse than getting stuck for a couple of weeks with some moron that you can&#8217;t even stand to sit next to for lunch.</p>
<p>But I counsel doing serious research in advance before laying out your hard earned money. If I can ever be of help, I&#8217;ll give it to you straight. Contact me: <a href="mailto:bretgilliam@gmail.com">bretgilliam@gmail.com</a></p>
<p>Good luck!</p>
<p>Bret
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